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smithy

Existential Phenomenology

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looking for a good overview of this subject? any suggestions (please not wiki and not the first 20 hits from google, been there!)

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Not sure what exactly you're looking for. You could try Sartre's 'Being and Nothingness'. Not the easiest of books to read though.

;)

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For an introduction, you could try the relevant chapters in 'Oxford Textbook of Philosophy and Psychiatry'.

The best overview (i.e. easiest to read!) is probably provided by 'A First Introduction to Existential Phenomenology' by Luijpen and Koren. It is however old and hard to find.

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For an introduction, you could try the relevant chapters in 'Oxford Textbook of Philosophy and Psychiatry'.

The best overview (i.e. easiest to read!) is probably provided by 'A First Introduction to Existential Phenomenology' by Luijpen and Koren. It is however old and hard to find.

Is this the one you refer to?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/First-Introduction-Existential-Phenomenology-Luijpen/dp/0820701106/sr=8-1/qid=1158775295/ref=sr_1_1/202-6277636-0632637?ie=UTF8&s=gateway

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looking for a good overview of this subject? any suggestions (please not wiki and not the first 20 hits from google, been there!)

why existential phenemonology...... why why why why why why?

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looking for a good overview of this subject? any suggestions
why existential phenemonology...... why why why why why why?
why not?

Interesting...

;)

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existential vaccum

Does existential vacuum really exist??  :-?

Does vacuum really exist?  :-/

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O.k. I've heard of Jean Paul Sartre, but could anyone enlighten as to the whole existential debate? I have a vague idea of it being to do with 'being and nothingness' and the whole problem of not being able to prove that you do exist, or that anything exists. No cogito ergo sum to help out now... Anyone prepared to say what they know about the topic, and if there are points that can apply to psychiatry?

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existential vaccum

Does existential vacuum really exist??  :-?

Does vacuum really exist?  :-/

Here it is...

The existential vacuum is a widespread phenomenon of the twentieth century. This is understandable; it may be due to a twofold loss which man has had to undergo since he became a truly human being. At the beginning of human history, man lost some of the basic animal instincts in which an animal's behavior is imbedded and by which it is secured. Such security, like Paradise, is closed to man forever; man has to make choices. In addition to this, however, man has suffered another loss in his more recent development inasmuch as the traditions which buttressed his behavior are now rapidly diminishing. No instinct tells him what he has to do, and no tradition tells him what he ought to do; sometimes he does not even know what he wishes to do. Instead, he either wishes to do what other people do (conformism) or he does what other people wish him to do (totalitarianism).

http://www.monkeyrivertown.com/brains.php?ART=192

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I refer you to Jean Anouilh, the French existentialist playwright, and in particular his play 'Becket'.

In summary, we exist. Our existence is futile & pointless. To make it bearable we create purpose and meaning from what we do & perceive, and in our standpoints and roles.

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I refer you to Jean Anouilh, the French existentialist playwright, and in particular his play 'Becket'.

In summary, we exist. Our existence is futile & pointless. To make it bearable we create purpose and meaning from what we do & perceive, and in our standpoints and roles.

And then we die. :-? Great. :-/

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Not great, just maybe more realistic than a Disney version with 'And then we all went to heaven' at the end of it.

Sometimes a little depressing, but it can make the one life we've definitely got a little more important not to throw away. :)

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Smithy,

Could you please explain the context in which you are asking? i.e, set the scene for this discussion.

You may not enthuse people if 'people' here do not understand how is it relevant to most us.

get my drift.....

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Smithy,

If I started this topic, then I would briefly summarise my knowledge on the topic,talk about which practical experience made me visit this area of fairly abstract science/philosophy & ask specific questions(I don't know what they are to be honest).

All of us get the same training,experience blah blah blah, So my guess is there will be very few with any expertise in this are if any on this forum.(just my guess) Unless there was any exam relevance or practical relevance, few would be interested.

just my thoughts.

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i think understanding existentialism is an essential part to psychiatry. i would probably go as far to say that with most psy illness that we see, some existential issues are present at the heart of it. existentialism deals with the aspect of subjectiveness as opposed to rationalism, the meaning and value of life, survival which every human being defines himself. Thus somebody who we routinely see with self harm may actually have some existential problems interms of experiencing his well being, a depressed patient searches the meaning for carrying on living and a psychotic patients subjectivity has gone haywire.. :). i am sure we cant deny that a major aprt of our work would be to bring some purpose back into our patients lives in their own ways... this in essence is existentialism itself on a practical level. If one may observe it i s an integral part of many eastern philosophies and religions.

a long one but hope it helps... :)

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you could say that, but then you could equally say that existentialism has nothing at all behind it and that most of the stuff written about it consists of a stream of sentences that, although (mostly) grammatically correct, have no meaning.

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am with you on this one 'J'.

Jollyman,

Subjective experiences are treacherous in real clinical practice for your subjective experience differs from mine & so what you consider relevant  is may be immaterial to me. And so quite often causes conflicts in teams & between teams.

finally all subjective experiences will be a load of hot air if we dont have funding to achieve what we want to achieve with our patients. I hate to say this but its money in the end that matters to us, to our patients , to the tax payer & the Government, except the altruistic & conscientous practisioners.

just my opinion.

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From j,

you could say that, but then you could equally say that existentialism has nothing at all behind it and that most of the stuff written about it consists of a stream of sentences that, although (mostly) grammatically correct, have no meaning.

This could just as easily be said of any form of philosophy, and about all that has been written by the various writers in psychiatry. However I don't think that makes it any less deserving of thought, and indeed raises further questions regarding the nature of language and its representation (accurate or otherwise) of our thoughts, and whether any of them express real concepts in the world.

finally all subjective experiences will be a load of hot air if we dont have funding to achieve what we want to achieve with our patients. I hate to say this but its money in the end that matters to us, to our patients , to the tax payer & the Government, except the altruistic & conscientous practisioners.

I have to say that I disagree with this. Money is what allows the NHS to provide the service it does in the settings that it does. It has little to do with the practice of psychiatry as a way of interpreting and understanding the thought processes of others and what that means in understanding ourselves as humans. Given that we do not rely on diagnostic tests it is possible to do that sort of psychiatry anywhere, and peoples descriptions of their subjective experiences are surely key to it. Just because we are tied into a system that rewards us financially for our work doesn't mean we should accept that as being the only way to practice.

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