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Gurpal

2008 February - Paper 2 feedback

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Please post your feedback on the Paper 2 exam. If you can remember any questions and stems, please include them. Please do not discuss answers in this thread.

Thank you and good luck!

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not sure of others but i think not even the consultants could pass in this kind of paper

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Well, that came as something of a shock. A great deal of emphasis on the symptomatology of lobe lesions including EEG appearance, incidence rates for psychiatric disease, genetics and, for some reason, Child and Adolscent Psychiatry!

The question style has changed significantly. Rather than being presented with a stem naming a condition and a list of symptoms one of which may be correct you are presented with a description of symptoms that someone comes to see you with and from that you've to work out what they've got and then, based on that figure out what the result of some test might be. For example:

A 37 year old woman comes to see you complaining of jerky movements of her arm and neck, her mother died in a nursing home in her 60's what EEG findings would you expect to see in this woman? (sorry, don't remember the answers)

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well...................it's the worst set paper.......ANY ONE CAN IMAGINE...........

>:( >:( >:(

every question made my blood boil...........(or is that my genes saying that.. or should we do an epiemiological study of that.....iam sorry....i dont know what iam blabbering.!!!..)

the questions r horrible......

for example...............

the % of wome felt suicidal in the last year study..........

( which year r they talking about .......2006 or 2007)...........which study....?????.... :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-? :-?????

and funny enough ....the next question is about males in the same context........

horrible.....horrible.........

after giving the exam...............i felt what is the suicidal thoughts % after the mrcpsych exam today ............this can be a next year question..............

this is not a paper for psychiatrists....!!!!! it's 4 epidemiologists/statisticians/geneticists :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o

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It was not a standard exam.

It was crap especially paper-2.I do not think even most competent new consultant ,research oriented can score 50% in this type of paper.we should this with our clinical tutors,so that they convey our message to college.

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:-/ i have sat a few exams in my life..... and i can say for sure that this was the worst exam ever!! not because it was difficult beyond beleif but in my opinion it was total rubbish !!!! can somone pleas explain to me why the heck do we need to know how many women/men/boys/gilrs/old ppl/ethnics/caucasians/chinese etc etc 'felt'suicidal in on year or why and where in this world does a sho ask a genitic engineer/technition what chemical is used to dye some godforsaken gener on a godforsaken chromosome for a disease that one is hardly ever going to come across...... i swear i could go on for like 30 pages on this crap but i am sure about what the use fo this exam is and that is 'NOTHING' !!!!!!!!!!!!!! it has nuthin to do with how good /bad a doctor is but i guess the idiots who came up with the exam would rather make our lives more miserable by making sure we know shit which is worth shit in the first place !!!

extreaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaamly disapointed !!!!!! :-X

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If you look to the above pool , there are 2 genius, saying the paper-2 was straight forward.Can you imagine. i think they are in stage of denial.

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:lol: haha ebrahimi..... that certainly brought a smile to my face......... uill always find idiots like them......

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It was not a standard exam.

It was crap especially paper-2.I do not think even most competent new consultant ,research oriented can score 50% in this type of paper.we should this with our clinical tutors,so that they convey our  message to college.

i agree...we should all take it up with our clinical supervisors to make sure our mesage is delivered to the royal college ...........but some how i dont think jack is goin to change......i guess we'd never know unless we try :)

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Hi everyone,

Like all of you guys I sat extremely difficult exams before/during/after/long after medical school(in different countries). Today's paper II was an exception if I may say. It was not standard based on any standard. Some fossil so-called consultant who is unfortunately attached to Royal College of Psych. opens a journal that s/he is never going to read,chooses one sentence and that becomes a question for a Junior doctor! And the funniest part is that that poor Junior doc has paid 195 Pounds hard earned cash for this utter shamble!

I'd like to put a few questions forward:

1-Isn't it the right time to formally complain about the treatment we receive from Royal College?Forget about your clinical tutors!What have they done for you so far?I am going to talk to BBC and/or newspapers.

2-Can Royal College not explain on what basis a Junior is supposed to know things which are of no apparent use in daily practice or even vast field of psychiatric research?

3-Shouldn't Royal College be more transparent about how they mark us on these ridiculous papers?

4-Who is responsible for quality control of these exams?

5-Anyone knows of a single psychiatrist who is able to memorize that kind of material(?) as a Nobel prize should be awarded to such a person(I haven't quite figured out Nobel prize in what!)

6-Can anyone explain why in 21st century these societies still call themselves Royal?Is it because they bear the same old-fashioned unjustifiable persistence?

7-Why the exam hall was so cold? Did we not pay enough money?If no,how much do you think we should pay next time?I am sure RCPsych would welcome any figure more than 195 Pounds.

8-I appreciate if people are tired of all this but we should do something,don't you think?

Goodnight all other Js,

Fss.

P.S:

' Junior doc':they way they call us in this country!...it really annoys me when I think that with an M.D in medicine and some more very respectable qualifications and at the age of 35! I am still a Junior!...When do we count as adults?

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I empathise with you guys and I would like to point few more things:

First, the poll may be biased and I have contributed to this in a way. This site would not allow people to view the results unless they vote. I am preparing for paper 3 and was curious to know what people thoughts were and therefore I voted for the 3rd option.

Second, Where is PMETB in all this?? They are the regulatory buddy for Specialist training, to my knowledge. I think any complaint should be directed to them in the first instance. The problem is that, as usual, the PMETB will ask the college for guidance on replying to the complaine; ha ha ha really funny.

Third, I think we, those sitting Spring 2008 exams, are the most unlucky patch with regard to exam as we are sitting the first new exams. Later on, questions will repeat and people will memorise them and pass. This has been the case with college exams. I remember many Part 1 questions which do not make any sense but we just knew useless facts to pass them.

I think, we have to ask the college to formally publish the skills / knowledge tested in this paper and compare them against the published person specifictions or PMETB competencies

Finally, we are Modernised Medical Trainees. Keep Smiling Modern Doctors

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I empathise with you guys and I would like to point few more things:

First, the poll may be biased and I have contributed to this in a way. This site would not allow people to view the results unless they vote. I am preparing for paper 3 and was curious to know what people thoughts were and therefore I voted for the 3rd option.

Second, Where is PMETB in all this?? They are the regulatory buddy for Specialist training, to my knowledge. I think any complaint should be directed to them in the first instance. The problem is that, as usual, the PMETB will ask the college for guidance on replying to the complaine; ha ha ha really funny.

Third, I think we, those sitting Spring 2008 exams, are the most unlucky patch with regard to exam as we are sitting the first new exams. [highlight]Later on, questions will repeat [/highlight]and people will memorise them and pass. This has been the case with college exams. I remember many Part 1 questions which do not make any sense but we just knew useless facts to pass them.

I think, we have to ask the college to formally publish the skills / knowledge tested in this paper and compare them against the published person specifictions or PMETB competencies

Finally, we are Modernised Medical Trainees. Keep Smiling Modern Doctors

If this is one of the strtegy to pass exams ,can i request people to post questions as they remember.This gives some hope to future candidates and also we will know what to concentrate on and read the subject around the topics covered.

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Unfortunately this is one of the strategies to pass exams; I mean RCPsych exams. You need to memorize that the incidence of disease x is 1 in 500 and not 1 in 480 and you need to memorize who did what and when. However, looking at Paper 1 questions; I thought they make more sense than the old Part 1

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Yesterday's paper 2 was a real rotter. But I think the real problem was that there was very little to go on in terms of syllabus. I've taken a look at what the college made available, and it seems that we were prior warned to an extent, but if, like me, you were basing your expectations on what was needed for the old part 1 then a nasty shock was in store. I've definitely failed - if they pass me they'll have to pass everyone!

I've done a lot of exams in my time now and I'm heartened that things that might seem impossible one day, seem a lot easier a few months down the line. With luck the college may mellow subsequent papers based on the response to this one.

I've written more on my blog www.frontierpsychiatrist.co.uk

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I agree with all the above with regards to paper 2.

It is the shit exam I have ever come across.

I dont think the USMLE will set a paper like this(still they get I think atleast 6 hours or so to finish the exam) which has got quite a few questions as paragraphs rather than couple of lines.

Lastly there is no bloody point in trying to figure out the questions as even the person who prepared the questions wont be able to do that...

SHAME ON THE GUYS WHO PREPARED THE PAPER 2 FOR A TRAINEE PSYCHIATRIST WITH JUST OVER 12 MONTHS EXPERIENCE...

AND WHAT MORE TO SAY ....

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my personal opinion is the college should cancel especially paper-2 and arrange another date for us with standard paper.

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I empathize with everyone who had a hard time during the paper 2 . I sat the pilot exam organized by the royal college last year and i had same experience. I more or less guessed in all questions.

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Paper 2- Absolute shocker.

No wonder why they stopped Part 1 OSCE's and then come with these kind of theory papers. I don't think anybody is against Epidemiology or transcultural psychiatry or genetics or for that matter psychiatric services in the primary care.

The frustrating thing is that Royal College doesnot give a clear syllabus like, what is the depth of knowledge they expect us to know?

I think Royal College, Clinical tutors and Education committe, if it exists- should come out with clear guidelines. We definetly expect better treatment.

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I sat for my paper 2 yesterday and have been feeling totally demoralised , worthless, fatalistic and suicidal since then.

I am ashamed to be a part of this absolute shambles that is rocking the shores of British Isles at the moment.

I do not understand what are the royal college and PMETB trying to achieve by setting such a paper in the first place.

Is this their way of getting back on us all for criticising MMC/MTAS?

Has these questions been tried on existing members of royal college to see how they answer them?

I would like to know how we can register our displeasure and make the powers that be take notice.

Any bright ideas, please?

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Why you talking about USMLE guys. I think it is unfair to compare any of the MRCPsych examinations to such a well-established and respected medical licencing examination systems. We are very far away from USMLE; the only thing in common is the best of five format.

Also, do not mention PMETB as I do not think it has anything actually to do with training or exam. In theory it is the regulatory body but this is not happening. Even article 14 applications are sent to the college for guidance and approval !! The sentence thing that can describe what is happening nowadays is Prof Tooke's openion &quot:lol:amaging episode of British Medicine'. Nobody knows how long it will last for and what are the consequences

Cancelling Paper 2 and rearranging another exam is extremely unlikely. Even if the College admits that the exam was not standard etc, they will never do this and tell everybody they failed to assess their trainees !!

I am waiting to face the unknown on the 11th of March paper-3

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IT WOULD BE GREAT IF EVERYONE CONVEYS THEIR OPINION ABOUT PAER 2 TO THE ROYAL COLLEGE EXAMINATION SECTION. THERE ARE EMAILS OF THE CHIEF EXAMINER ON THE ROYAL COLLEGE WEBSITE.

OTHERWISE THEY WOOULD PRESUME THAT EVERYHING WAS OK AND COME OUT WITH WORSE PAPERS IN FUTURE.

OF COURSE NOTHING CAN BE WORSE THAN THE CURRENT PAER 2 :D :D :D

IF THE ROYAL COLLEGE WANTS MONEY THEY CAN COLLECT IT IN SOME OTHER FORM BUT NOT IN THIS WAY !!!!

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it was absolute bloodbath at hammersmith town hall assembly hall which was as cold as the darkest arctic.

I died and died and died at last count it was 174 to be precise.

This undoubtedly is the worst exam experience in my life and i doubt that any in the future will beat this.

The questions were so rubbish that I was marking the sheets without even going through the options.

Absolute nightmare especially after giving paper 1 in the morning for 3 hours sitting in the freezing town hall. Is this exam supposed to test our capabilities of practising as a psychiatrist or is it about physical and mental torture endurance :-?

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I do think you guys arent helping yourselves here.

Dont see anyone post past questions and helping others out, or hey it might even help you later. Sooner the better before you forget the lot.

ALSO. I understand your anger and where it might be coming from. But when the old style paper 2 came out the questions looked totally random too.

What the heck, having done the past papers a gazillion times - when i saw my old style paper 2 i went WTF with most of the questions.

the baboon questions i was expecting, but not the left field ejaculation is associated with paroxysmal headache. or children of mums with hypochondriasis enjoy playing with doctor sets more or something like that. WTF.

good thing i found it in myself to see the funny side then, guess my way through and laugh about it later. with regular coffee breaks in between papers. four papers of an hour and a half each is not a joke. and now its for the part 1 too. saw a pretty chill dude friend of mine looking shell shocked after part 1 and 2 yesterday.

but yeah. left field questions are the norm esp with the old part 2. in fact i was told not to look at past papers by several people, as it wouldnt help - even on the boards (good thing i didnt take their advice)i went into the paper thinking they are going to throw a lotta left field stuff at me. but im going to be prepared by knowing the old left field stuff theyre repeating. and if i know more left field answers than half the candidates.. im in with a chance. (which brings me back to - do post the questions guys. rant too. but post a few questions.)

yeah. if it does help - despite how difficult the questions were.. the 45% or so of the best prepared of you guys will pass. as always.

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I do think you guys arent helping yourselves here.

Dont see anyone post past questions and helping others out, or hey it might even help you later. Sooner the better before you forget the lot.

ALSO. I understand your anger and where it might be coming from. But when the old style paper 2 came out the questions looked totally random too.

What the heck, having done the past papers a gazillion times - when i saw my old style paper 2 i went WTF with most of the questions.

the baboon questions i was expecting, but not the left field ejaculation is associated with paroxysmal headache. or children of mums with hypochondriasis enjoy playing with doctor sets more or something like that. WTF.

good thing i found it in myself to see the funny side then, guess my way through and laugh about it later. with regular coffee breaks in between papers. four papers of an hour and a half each is not a joke. and now its for the part 1 too. saw a pretty chill dude friend of mine looking shell shocked after part 1 and 2 yesterday.  

but yeah. left field questions are the norm esp with the old part 2. in fact i was told not to look at past papers by several people, as it wouldnt help - even on the boards (good thing i didnt take their advice)i went into the paper thinking they are going to throw a lotta left field stuff at me.  but im going to be prepared by knowing the old left field stuff theyre repeating. and if i know more left field answers than half the candidates.. im in with a chance. (which brings me back to - do post the questions guys. rant too. but post a few questions.)

yeah. if it does help - despite how difficult the questions were.. the 45% or so of the best prepared of you guys will pass. as always.

i agree with what u r saying but cannot help at all cos i cannot even remember a single straightforward question other than one question on olanzapine and weioght gain which even a kindergarten kid wud answer.but apart from that mate believe me i am not exaggerating it at all i had no idea what ran over me.While taking the exam i was thinking that no one would be able to even reproduce these questions outside in supeego cafe or elsewhere.only those who sat the exam will understand what i am talking about. :o

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